[ARCHIVED] Best Practices for Offering Choice Between Discussion Boards

[873179959]

Hello Community,

I have some courses where the instructor wants students to be able to choose between 2-3 graded discussion boards to participate in in a given week. What is the best way to do this so that it doesn't mess up the gradebook?

Option 1: differentiated assignments: Students would sign up in a separate wiki page to indicate which board they wanted to participate in, and then the instructor would go into the discussion board settings and assign that board to specific students.

   Downside: students can't view the other boards, and this is a pain to set up for the instructor

Option 2: Have all discussion boards assigned to everyone and worth the same number of points (say, 10 points each), and a student can just pop into the board they want to participate in, and you just give them a grade for the discussion board they did participte in. As long as you don't use the "treat ungraded as zero" option in the gradebook, it will only calculate a score for the board they do participate in and ignore the other discussion assignments when calcultating their final grade.

   Downside: You can't use "treat ungraded as zero" in the gradebook, and we use AspireEdu's Dropout Detective student analytics and support system, which will show them as "at risk" because it looks like they failed to complete an assigned item. instructors were just giving them 10 points on all three choice even though they only participated in one, just so it didn't mark them as missing an assignment, which skewed the relative value of that discussion board.

Option 3: Make them all ungraded discussions, and just have a separate assignment woth 10 points where the instructor would capture the grades for their participation that week.

   Downside: You couldn't use Speedgrader. The instructor would have to go into each board, look to see what the students posted in various boards, and then go back into the other assignment column in the gradebook to enter feedback and a grade.  Also, the boards themselves wouldn't show up on a student's to-do list. If they clicked on the assignment in their to-do list, it wouldn't bring them to the boards.

Option 4: Group Discussion: Set up the discussion as a group discussion board, assign students to the different groups, and just make sure each group knew which topic they were discussing. 

   Downside, this still has the same set-up hassles as the differentiated assignments option, and they couldn't see what the other groups were saying. Plus, you'd have to find a way to make sure each group knew which prompt was assigned to them.

Does anyone have a better idea? I wish Canvas had some way for students to self-select and assign.

[venitk]

"treat ungraded as zero" only applies a mask onto the gradebook; it doesn't actually convert missing grades to 0. the thing you're thinking of is the missing submission policy: https://community.canvaslms.com/docs/DOC-16568-4152826328 

We've used Option 2, but we don't use the dropout detective tool you mentioned, so that's not a problem for us. I'm really curious what other people say. 

I haven't tried this, but could the discussions be graded but worth 0 points? Would that allow the instructor to still use speedgrader and then copy the grade into a separate assignment? Although I suppose you'd still have the problem with the dropout detective. hmmm....

[ericwhitmer]

Katie, making any assignment worth 0 points, Canvas will treat that as extra credit and artificially inflate the scores when you give the students credit for participating in that discussion. Also you may be creating duplicate assignments with two different grades which may trigger that dropout detective software for having a zero point assignment and a regular assignment.

[venitk]

Yes, the instructor wouldn't put the grade in the discussion because you're right, that would appear as extra credit. It would go into a separate assignment. That would definitely lead to duplicate assignments, though, as you say. Unless... the discussions were in their own group that counted for whatever percentage of the grade (and no additional assignment). Would it behave like extra credit then? Hmm...That would probably still trigger the Dropout Detective, though. 

873179959, Have you considered having students grade themselves? I haven't done this yet, but I might be designing a course for Fall that follows laurakgibbs‌'s un-grading philosophy. 

[ericwhitmer]

In my class for the Introduction for Health Informatics, the instructor there has 13 discussion board assignments and the students can choose 10 of them. She has rules in the background that drop the 3 lowest scores. Every assignment board is 5 points a piece.

Hope this helps.

[ericwhitmer]

I am a student in the mentioned class, not an instructor. She addressed how Canvas handles the assignments in class recently.

[kmeeusen]

Hi 873179959 

I also value choice for my students, and this is how I do it.........

• I create one discussion each week,
• In the instructions for that discussion I create multiple related topics that the students can choose from (the numbers vary, or course),
• I instruct the students to include the chosen topic at the top of their reply. The vast majority follow that instruction, so it has never been a problem.
• I then create a grading rubric that is generic enough to support the students' choices.

I hope this is helpful,

Kelley

[Shar]

I second Kelley's approach to multiple topics in the same discussion!

The students just really have to make sure they start their post with the Topic in the first line and then it's easy to find other folks in the same topic through the search feature(1) or different topics by collapsing replies(3) and then just the first line is shown.

https://community.canvaslms.com/docs/DOC-10536-4212351343 

After a little practice, students should be able to get the hang of it and with the right rubric, you can grade any discussion!

Hope the advice helps,
Cheers - Shar

[venitk]

 @kmeeusen ‌, would you be willing to share a screen shot of one of these discussion prompts so I can see your wording?

[kmeeusen]

Sure,  @venitk 

Here is the pertinent extract from one................

Forum Topic: Choose one topic from below. These topics will require research. I want this in your own words but I don't want opinions, I want the best facts that money can buy. Cite your sources!

1. Discuss lifestyle decisions that could potentially make an individual more likely to develop renal disease (be specific - how and why), and what steps individuals can take to lessen their chances of developing renal disease.
2. Discuss the relationship between hypertension and impotence (be specific about structure and function)
3. Discuss the relationship between diabetes and renal disease (again, be specific)

Include your topic as the first line of your reply!

I hope this is helpful,

Kelley

[venitk]

Thanks  @kmeeusen ! We've been wrestling with this question for a while. This solution is so simple, it almost seems too good to be true! I have follow up questions:

• For reals, this doesn't get confusing for the students and/or instructor?
• How large are your discussion groups?
• How does it go when students respond to each other? 
• In general, how long do the posts tend to be?

[kmeeusen]

Hi again,  @venitk  !

Of course it's simple. I am old, and always subscrribe to the K.I.S.S. principle!

• For reals, maybe once every couple/three terms I get a student who replies to all of the topics. Not sure if they are just confused or over zealous. I ask them, but they never answer me, so I suspect the former. And I do get some who forget to note their topic, but only on the first discussion. They tend to remember better aft a couple points are deducted from their score.
• I don't use groups, my discussions are for all students.
• This is always problematic, and always will be; but my rubric is very clear, and I provide examples of good initial replies and classmate replies to help them, so the classmate replies improve as the term progresses. I have found it helpful to keep my topics engaging and somewhat controversial when possible - that always helps.
• Although I always get those few OCD overachievers who want to post the entire Encyclopedia Britannica (Unabridged), most are around 300 - 350 words. It really depends on the topics.

As for engaging topics, here are some helpful resources I share with my own faculty (I am both an online teacher and a Canvas Admin)..............

• Successful Strategies for Creating Online Discussion Prompts (Cengage)

• Discussion Prompts (University of Central Florida)

I am a huge fan of online discussions!

Kelley

[venitk]

Well gosh, we might have been overthinking this whole choice in discussions thing. I'll see if I can find a course to try this out on. Thanks for the followup,  @kmeeusen !

[kmeeusen]

No problem,  @venitk   any time!

Kelley

[Shar]

Hi Kelley!

Yeah controversial topic indeed!

the relationship between hypertension and impotence

Cheers - Shar

[Shar]

Hi  @venitk ,

Here's my example with a group discussion with multiple topics --or in this case multiple scenarios. The groups are like 3-5 people large or whatever the instructor has decided to set up. The understanding is that since it's subset of the larger class that most/all of the posts will be read so it'll be easy to distinguish who is responding on the other topic/scenario.

The scenario text is a little lengthy so it's behind a toggle-reveal button. In mobile there's a message pointing ya back to the full-size browser to read the scenario. This discussion is near the beginning of the course so there's the reminder of how to make sure you're in group discussion space.

In this discussion since both scenarios have the same questions, the rubric checks for personal emotional response, answering the questions, and 2 responses. I guess someone could reply to someone in the same scenario, it's up to the instructor to deal with a consequence if any.

Unsolicited, but I wanted to share anyway,
Cheers - Shar

[venitk]

ishar-uw, your thoughts are always solicited.  

Questions: 

• "The scenario text is a little lengthy so it's behind a toggle-reveal button." What do you use to make this toggle button? 
• It doesn't look like you do quite the same thing as Kelley, where they say in the first line which scenario they're responding to. Is it pretty clear from the context which scenario they picked? With smaller groups like this, I would imagine it's easier to sort through. 

[Shar]

Hi Katie,

Yes, in a small group situation it's easy to sort through the posts and figure out which scenario folks are responding to. If I were to do a whole class discussion with multiple topics, I definitely would have them put the Topic as the first line of the post and even model it a screen shot.

The Toggle-Reveal is one of those tricks hanging about the community using class=element_toggler. I use a modified one that has separate content for the mobile folks. Element Toggler 

Here's my code (minus the scenario text):

<p style="text-align: center; padding-bottom: 0;"><span class="element_toggler btn btn-primary" 
role="button" aria-controls="scenario" aria-label="Toggler for scenario" aria-expanded="false">
Scenario Name</span></p>
<div class="hidden-desktop">Visit this discussion in a full-size web-browser to read the scenario.</div>
<div id="scenario" class="border-round" style="display: none; margin: 10px 30px; padding: 10px; background-color: aliceblue;"  
title="The scenario">
<p>This is the text of the scenario. Use as many paragraphs as needed and remember to end with a closing div</p>. 
</div>‍‍‍‍‍‍‍‍

Cheers - Shar

(Edited to use the Syntax highlighter)

[kmeeusen]

Hi @Shar 

Thank you for your contribution! That is an awesome little HTML snippet, so I stole it because I'm a thief!

Kelley

[kmeeusen]

Hi @venitk 

Here is one.....................

Chapter 3 Discussion Topic: Pick one of the eating disorders listed below, research it on the internet, and write a brief discussion of the disease process for your choice. This forum assesses your ability to read, understand and apply medical terminology to real world contexts and medical writings.

• All postings must be in your own words! Copying and pasting from the internet will not be accepted!
• You must cite your sources!

Read the postings of your classmates, and reply to at least one classmate's postings following the guidelines set forth in the syllabus

Include the following in your discussion (you must address each item in your discussion to receive full credit):

• Briefly describe the pathophysiology of the disease
• Provide its etiology
• Common signs and symptoms
• Diagnosis
• Treatment
• Prognosis
• Prevention

Eating Disorders:

1. Anorexia Nervosa
2. Bulimia
3. Binge Eating Disorder (BED)
4. Diabulimia
5. Orthorexia nervosa
6. Rumination
7. Pica
8. Night Eating Syndrome (NES)
9. Sleep-related Eating Disorder (S-RED)
10. Obesity

Original posting due Friday 1/22/21

Replies due Monday 1/25/21

Value: 25 points